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savings by shifting to cheaper substandard second-hand subs stuffups....
Defence Minister Richard Marles says taxpayers will save money by ditching a plan to acquire a new and upgraded nuclear-powered submarine from the United States, but experts warn Australia will receive a less capable vessel with a shorter lifespan under the AUKUS shift. Marles and US Defence Secretary Pete Hegseth on Saturday said the last of three Virginia-class submarines Australia plans to buy from the US will now be second-hand rather than a new boat as originally planned. Under the AUKUS plan announced in 2023, Australia was to buy a mix of new and second-hand submarines from the US. The vision was for two second-hand US submarines to arrive beginning in 2032 and the third submarine was to be a new and improved Block VII Virginia-class boat. All three vessels will now be used Block IV submarines that may already have been in service for years, and possibly over a decade, each, compared with the 33-year lifespan of a new boat. Marles defended the decision on the basis that it reduced complexity by ensuring all Virginia class boats were a consistent set, and there would be a “significant” reduction to the purchase price of the final US submarine and the associated training and operational costs. “We don’t get the additional cost and complexity of operating a one-off submarine which is different to all the rest,” Marles said in an interview. “The reality here is that is the single biggest issue and challenge associated with that third submarine if we keep it as it is, which is why we see this as a significantly good outcome.” He declined to quantify what the saving would be, but he said it wouldn’t substantially change the underlying cost of the AUKUS project. “We need to be chasing savings where we can and be as prudent as possible, so [this decision] matters. But this is a big program, and we get this one submarine cheaper — it doesn’t fundamentally alter the overall envelope here, which is 0.15 per cent of GDP.” Pressed on why Australia had sought a new submarine under the “optimal” AUKUS pathway if a used model represented a better outcome, Marles said: “We are just as happy to go down this path because it very much does give us consistency.” He declined to put a figure on how many years left of service the third submarine would have by the time it was transferred to Australian hands, but he said it would arrive in a condition consistent with the first and second used boats and that it would still have “a lot of years of service left”. “What we’re getting is a submarine well within its life, immediately after deep maintenance,” he said. It would have “more than half” of its operational life left, he said. The decision is widely believed to be linked to senior Pentagon official Elbridge Colby’s AUKUS review, which was completed at the end of last year but has not been made public. Colby had previously expressed concern that providing Virginia-class submarines to Australia could deplete the US Navy’s reserves, given sluggish American production rates. Asked whether lags in the US production schedule had contributed to this shift in direction, Marles said: “It’s definitely not part of this decision at all.” Marles, Hegseth and British Defence Secretary John Healey said in a statement that the decision was about “simplifying supply chain management, operational and maintenance requirements, and maximising cost efficiencies”. The government estimates the total cost of the AUKUS scheme will be between $268 billion and $368 billion over three decades, making it the biggest defence procurement project in Australian history. Opposition defence spokesman James Paterson said: “This appears to be a significant change of plan for acquisition of Virginia-class submarines ... I will be seeking an explanation from Defence at Senate estimates this week about why this change was made and what the implications are.” Former senior defence official Michael Shoebridge said: “This is bad news. The new Virginias are more capable and easier to maintain ... The US aren’t building enough submarines so they are keeping the more capable ones for themselves.” The new Block VII submarine Australia had been slated to acquire from the late 2030s has been described by trade publication Army Recognition as “one of the final and most advanced versions of the Virginia-class submarine, with improved stealth, greater use of unmanned underwater systems, and enhanced capability for long-range strike and seabed operations”. Virginia-class submarines are estimated to cost $US5 billion ($6.95 billion) each to produce, including weapons, according to the US congressional research service. Marles said there had long been debate about whether Australia should seek to acquire a new submarine from the US, as this could mean the Australian navy would be operating four different types of submarine at once: the Collins-class submarine, two types of Virginia-class submarine and the new SSN-AUKUS nuclear-powered submarine being developed between Britain and Australia. Greens senator David Shoebridge said it was ridiculous for Marles to paint the decision as a win for Australia, describing AUKUS as a “dud deal” for Australia. “You cannot make this stuff up on AUKUS,” he said. Former naval officer Jennifer Parker said she supported the decision, while acknowledging there were downsides to the move. “This reduces risk and complexity in what is already a very ambitious program,” said Parker, an adjunct fellow in naval studies at UNSW. “If the three submarines we buy come from the same block, they will have the same configuration, same training and maintenance requirements and same spare parts. We won’t have to put them through the trials for initial certification. These boats will still be streets ahead of any other attack submarines in the world.” However, she added: “The third submarine will now be a less capable boat than it would have been and will have less life in it. It may have 20 years left of service rather than 33.”
READ FROM TOP. PLEASE VISIT: YOURDEMOCRACY.NET RECORDS HISTORY AS IT SHOULD BE — NOT AS THE WESTERN MEDIA WRONGLY REPORTS IT — SINCE 2005. Gus Leonisky POLITICAL CARTOONIST SINCE 1951. RABID ATHEIST. WELCOME TO THIS INSANE WORLD….
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not the best....
AUKUS. From ‘best’ we’ll never get to second hand subs
by Rex Patrick
Defence Minister Marles announced a change to the AUKUS submarine program: second-hand subs! What’s the scam?
The scam is, at an enormous cost of (at least) $368B, we now only get second-hand subs from the US while we wait for the promised nuclear subs on the never-never.
In May 2023, Admiral Mead, the head of the Australian Submarine Agency, told the Senate that the first two Virginia-class subs that would be transferred to Australia would be second-hand, and the remaining subs would be brand new. He repeated it a year later.
But the reality is and always has been different. The US is only building about 1.2 subs per annum and needs to get to a built rate of 2.0 to meet US needs, and 2.3 to meet theirs and ours. They have no way of getting there.
We’ve sent $2.8B non-refundable taxpayers’ dollars to the US over the past two years to try to shift the build rate dial, and it’s done nothing, other than drain our Treasury.
Anyone who bothers to read the US Congressional Research Service’s advice to Congress on AUKUS knows we will not get subs from the US. Anyone who has bothered to read the recently released UK Parliamentary report on AUKUS knows we will not get subs from the UK.
The Albanese Government has embarked on an all-eggs-in-one-basket program where,
the US hens are not laying enough eggs, and the UK chooks are headless.
Meanwhile, Defence Minister Richard Mares maintains the facade. He’s either dishonest or dumb. Time will tell which one it is.
https://michaelwest.com.au/aukus-from-best-well-never-get-to-second-hand-subs/
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YOURDEMOCRACY.NET RECORDS HISTORY AS IT SHOULD BE — NOT AS THE WESTERN MEDIA WRONGLY REPORTS IT — SINCE 2005.
Gus Leonisky
POLITICAL CARTOONIST SINCE 1951.
RABID ATHEIST.
WELCOME TO THIS INSANE WORLD….
PLEASE GIVE UP THIS AUKUS INSANITY....
simply, not the best....
Catriona Jackson
That sinking feeling – Message from the Editor [P&I]Sometimes you just have to wait.
I’m not a very patient person, but I have learned two things about patience and persistence:
the hard, really important stuff never comes quickly; and
issues run in cycles. If you don’t hit the finish line this time, hang on: there will almost certainly be another opportunity.
The issue – this time round – is AUKUS: the multi-year, multi-stage, multi-billion-dollar three-way (Australia, UK, US) defence pact. In my first months at P&I, early last year, I got way ahead of myself and declared a tipping point on the matter. The P&I community has been talking about the cracks and contradictions in the deal since before it was announced with huge bluster at that unforgettable three-way press conference with Joe Biden, Boris Johnson and Scott Morrison back in September 2021.
And it was Morrison who sat me back in my chair this week. After a week that, once again, highlighted the weakness of Australia’s position and growing community opposition to it, the former PM leapt to its defence.
He chose the ABC RN’s Global Roaming program to tell us not to worry: his ‘forever’ pact was on track. Later, he told the media, “Let’s not surrender because we think we’re not up to it.”
But the problem is not that we are not up to it – it is that the deal is falling apart, with more changes to it this week. Many of you will have heard the announcement from Defence Minister Richard Marles that we are now getting all second-hand Virginia-class submarines (the deal had been two second-hand and one new). The Minister and Defence officials then told Senate Estimates and media that three second-hand subs were actually what we wanted all along.
Really?
And it is not just the details, and the taxpayer’s money. It is more than that.
Mike Gilligan nailed it this week when he said: “The shift to second-hand Virginia-class submarines exposes the deeper flaw in AUKUS: Australia is committing vast public funds to a capability designed around US strategic priorities rather than Australia’s own defence needs.”
Former Prime Minister Paul Keating made it plain in P&I in March 2023 that the deal was a dud. He said AUKUS was the “worst international decision by an Australian Labor government since the former Labor leader, Billy Hughes, sought to introduce conscription to augment Australian forces in World War One.”
Gareth Evans backed up his former leader with pithy, devastating brevity: “AUKUS has been problematic from the outset, in terms of its deliverability, cost-benefit, and implications for our sovereign decision-making agency. Above all, the crazy irony of the whole project has always been that it commits Australia to spending eye-watering amounts to build a capability supposed to defend us from military threats which are in fact most likely to arise simply because we have that capability – and are using it to support the US in some conflict not in our interests to engage in – without any guarantee of support in return should we ever need it.”
So you’d think that would be it. Party elders don’t dictate policy, obviously, but this level of pushback from Labor figures of such substance is pretty unusual.
Fast forward to this week, and former Federal Minster Ed Husic has broken ranks on the matter and a public inquiry into AUKUS has been launched. It will be headed by Peter Garrett, and include former Western Australian premier Carmen Lawrence and former chief of the Australian Defence Force Chris Barrie. Garrett said AUKUS “was the most significant, and by far the most costly, decision made in secret by an Australian government, tying us to two other sovereign governments, and taking out an extraordinary amount of taxpayers’ money on a proposition which has got a lot of distinct and very difficult complexities and potential problems lying up ahead”.
Well, yes.
My best bit for this week was Peter Garrett telling us what he really thinks, via Midnight Oil’s 1982 US Forces. It
US forces gives the nod
It’s a setback for your country
Bombs and trenches all in rows
Bombs and threats still ask for more
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https://johnmenadue.com/post/2026/06/that-sinking-feeling-message-from-the-editor/
READ FROM TOP.
PLEASE VISIT:
YOURDEMOCRACY.NET RECORDS HISTORY AS IT SHOULD BE — NOT AS THE WESTERN MEDIA WRONGLY REPORTS IT — SINCE 2005.
Gus Leonisky
POLITICAL CARTOONIST SINCE 1951.
RABID ATHEIST.
WELCOME TO THIS INSANE WORLD….